The Bible Reveals when Jesus was Born!
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When was Jesus Born?
The Christmas story found in the Holy Bible (Luke 2) is cherished by all Christians. The birth of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ is the most important event in history, next to the day of His resurrection.
Our Lord Jesus Christ was the ‘firstborn of the new creation’ (Luke 1:35; Col 1:15) and ‘firstborn of the dead’ (Col 1:18; Rev 1:5). Likewise, we are born of the flesh, then born of the Spirit (John 3:6-7; 2 Cor 5:17), and will be raised from the dead (Rom 8:11). This is the miraculous gospel of salvation.
While multitudes around the world celebrate “Christmas”, whether they focus on Saint Nicholas (aka Santa Claus) and/or the birth of Jesus Christ, all Christians know Jesus was not born on December 25th. This date was established by the Roman Catholic church in approximately 360 AD, when they held a special mass to honor Christ, while the pagan world celebrated Saturnalia, a feast honoring the birth of their sun god. This eventually became known as "Christ-Mass". Why would we willingly celebrate Christmas on December 25th, knowing its pagan origins? Does it attract those of the world to the true God when they confuse the birth of YHWH with the birth of the Roman sun god? Why not celebrate the birth of Christ on His true birthday? Is He pleased? That is the question.
My subjective thoughts on the matter include how many of our celebrated ‘holy days’ (aka holidays) revolve around ‘saints’. Clue? Saint Valentine, Saint Patrick, All Saints Day, Saint Nicholas…come on. How blind are we? None of these saints are in the Bible. While the world may celebrate those they've deemed as ‘saints’ (who have passed on, no less), I celebrate the living God with the living saints (followers of Christ)! While Catholicism embraced pagans and their practices in order to grow their members, that and their ongoing violation of the second commandment tell me NOT to follow them down that road. Is it not ironic that the true saints of God who opposed the RCC were burned at the stake?
There are many historical and pivotal events in the history of the Church. Why don’t we move to make straight the crooked ways of the world? This is hardly martyrdom, in comparison to what the saints back in that day suffered. Did you know the Bible gives us clues to the exact date, and even the timeframe of the birth of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ? You might be surprised to find it appears to be September 11, 3 BC.
The Bible gives us Clues!
In the gospel of Luke (3:1) Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist. The Bible gives clues that John was born around the time of Passover (Nisan, in the Spring) and Jesus was born six months later, placing His birthdate in the Fall (Tishri). Jesus was 30 years old at the time of His baptism. Luke tied this event to the 15th year of Tiberius Caesar (which was in 27-28 AD). This would then place the birth of Christ in approximately 3 BC. While there's so much information out there confirming the birthdate of Jesus, here's just one noteworthy observation:
Let's look at Rev 12:1, 2 and 5:
“And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered. And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.” (KJV)
Historian Ernest L. Martin consulted NASA lunar-phase tables and found the image of the heavens in Revelation 12, the time of Jesus’ birth. “‘The moon under her feet’ could only occur during an eighty minute period on September 11th of 3 BC between sunset at ‘6:15pm and moonset at 7:45pm’ (The Birth of Christ Recalculated and The Star that Astonished the World, page 85, 1996.)
The Star of Bethlehem
Nativity scenes often include three wise men bowing at the cradle of the newborn babe. This is certainly not biblical. The Magi came from the East, following the great star that appeared in the sky over Bethlehem. Just how long was that star in the sky anyway? They certainly didn’t make the trip in a day. It’s possible it took over a year and would have placed them in Jerusalem about December of 2 BC. Jesus would have been 15 months old.
Is it any surprise that in 3 and 2 BC there were numerous conjunctions involving Jupiter, also known as the kingly or righteous planet (Craig Chester, Co-founder of the Monterey Institute for Research in Astronomy, The Star of Bethlehem):
August of 3 BC - Jupiter and Venus
September of 3 BC - Jupiter and Regulus
February of 2 BC - Jupiter and Regulus
May of 2 BC - Jupiter and Regulus
June of 2 BC - Jupiter and Venus
In Jesus Christ our Promised Seed, Victor Paul Wierwille states:
“As the Magi approached Bethlehem, Jupiter finally ‘stood over’ where the child was, the area of Bethlehem. The time period in which the Magi traveled to Bethlehem could only have been between December 4, 2 BC, when Jupiter could be seen in this position over Bethlehem, and before January 9, 1 BC, when the events surrounding the death of Herod began.”
Mat 2:16 aligns with the age of Jesus at that time: “Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men (because they did not return to tell Herod where Jesus was), was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently enquired of the wise men.” (KJV)
The Death of Herod
The following excerpt is taken from a publication called Prophecy Truths - Exact Date of Yeshua's Birth Part 5:
"What about the death of Herod as it relates to all this? After all, many scholars have said that king Herod died in 4 BC or 5 BC? Dr. Ernest L. Martin in his book, laboriously goes through each possibility for the death of king Herod and with a number of other scholars, proves that Herod died a couple of weeks after the total lunar eclipse of January 10, 1 BC. He pinpoints the date of death of Herod to about January 29, 1 BC plus or minus a couple of days.
Flavius Josephus wrote many details surrounding the death and burial of king Herod in his Jewish Antiquities. He writes that king Herod died shortly after a lunar eclipse. The lunar eclipses for that period of time in Israel were:
7 BC - no lunar eclipse
6 BC - no lunar eclipse
5 BC - total lunar eclipse on March 23, time between eclipse and Passover was 29 days
5 BC - total lunar eclipse on September 15, time between eclipse and Passover was 7 months
4 BC - partial lunar eclipse on March 13, time between eclipse and Passover was 29 days
3 BC - no lunar eclipse
2 BC - no lunar eclipse
1 BC - total lunar eclipse on January 10, time between eclipse and Passover was 12.5 weeks.
Dr. Martin and a number of other scholars have shown that given the details by Josephus and other historians of that time, that king Herod had to have died almost 3 weeks after the lunar eclipse. Then there were preparations for a royal burial and a 30-day period for the procession and burial. After that was over, the new king, Archelaus took care of many royal duties before Passover. Given all this, the two springtime lunar eclipses in 5 and 4 BC could not possibly be the lunar eclipse preceding king Herod's death. You'll have to read Dr. Martin's book to get all the details and other supporting information.
The point is that scholarship by Dr. Martin and others proves that what the Bible code shows in relation to the birth of Yeshua (Jesus) is both reasonable and expected."
Rosh Hashanah!
Finally, it is a beautiful revelation that the very day of our Lord’s birth in 3 BC was also the start of the Judean New Year known as Tishri 1 (The Day of Trumpets)! Today it’s called Rosh Hashanah. This Judean New Year started at sunset on September 11th of 3 BC at 6:15 pm, precisely when the “woman was clothed with the sun and the moon was under her feet”. This was the birthday of our King, Yeshua Ha-Mashiach!! It is no wonder; it is wonderful ~ for God’s timetable is perfect.
As I continue to research the birthdate of Christ, there are many articles. I have given three links below, the last of which reveals the Bible code, and I quote the result: "What it shows is that Yeshua (Jesus) was born on Rosh Hashanah (head of the year), which is also called Yom Teruah (day of blowing) and in English the Feast of Trumpets. It's also Rosh Khodesh which means the head of the month. Rosh Hashanah occurs on the 1st of Tishri every year in the jewish calendar, and is in the fall of the year. The matrix shows that the birth occurred in the jewish year 3759, which is the fall of 3 BC. In 3 BC, the 1st of Tishri occurred on September 11th. With the matrix showing Rosh Hashanah, Yom Teruah, Rosh Khodesh, and 'on 1 Tishri', it is clearly showing 1 Tishri as the exact day of Yeshua's birth."
So, as for me and my house, the nativity will be displayed (without the wise men) in September!!
Referenced sources:
http://www.bytheword.com/birth
http://ad2004.com/prophecytruths/Articles/Yeshua/yeshuabirth5.html
- The Truth Behind Christmas
I dont know if youre like me. Its taken me 46 years to finally want to know where our Christmas traditions come from. The closer I get to the Lord, the more I am uncomfortable about things I used to...
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I have heard that the birth of Jesus happened in the month of September but have never truly studied the date. You have broken it down here in easy to follow guidelines. Thanks Judah's Daughter!
Thank you for great information. Perhaps Lord did not gave us the date on purpose. Below say why:
Have Merry Christmas
whole year
and Happy New Year now
Thanks again
Awesome hub! I didn't know about the star projections, the planet Jupiter's placement but much of the rest we have known and studied here for a long time. We had gone by the same calculation and saw His birth being more around Yom Kippur or as it is also known, the Day of Atonement. And really, whatever day it is, we know it was not in Decemember, and the assimilation of pagan holy days by the Roman Catholics, should not be our stepping stone to truth. Peace
Hi DiamondRN! The more research I do, the more the September 11, 3 BC (Tishri 1) is confirmed. The Bible gives us so many revelations, and it is truly by the Jewish people we understand. I am blessed you came by to read and pray our Lord's blessings upon you as well.
Debradoo! Wonderful to see you again! Thank you for your kind encouragement. My heart's desire is to worship Him in spirit and truth. A man-made day to celebrate such a life-changing event should not sway the truth. I pray more and more Christians will research this, for there is overwhelming evidence given in the Word, while there is zero evidence for December 25th. Perhaps we'll live to see the day the followers of Christ celebrate His birth in September!! God bless you!!
Hello Vladimir, I can't say I agree with you that the date of Christ's birth was not given in the Bible. When people read without 'panning for God' they miss the living revelation within. While there are a couple of weeks' variation in the calculation date of Christ's birth between scholars, it is agreed that John the Baptist was born in Nisan, placing Jesus' birth in Tishri. We can be confident His birth was indeed in Tishri.
The third article link at the base of my hub ends with this statement: "Is there scriptural support for Yeshua (Jesus) being born on the 1st of Tishri? Yes, in 1 Corinthians 15:45 it says in talking about Yeshua, 'The first man, Adam, became a living soul. The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.' In 1 Corinthians 15:22, it states, 'For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ (the Messiah) all shall be made alive.' Yeshua is the second Adam, and the rabbi's have long taught that Adam's birthdate was on 1 Tishri. So it is no coincidence that the second Adam has the same exact birth date."
May we continue our quest to worship our Lord in spirit and truth.
I do not have any problem with it.
I just placed weight on resurrection. One cannot keep Lord Baby all the time and not let Him grow, the same one cannot keep Him on cross all the time. He is now sitting on the throne and is living and will come back. Everything is important but some is more than another...
I would have more comments but for now is enough.
really enjoyed all the astronomical facts and history of your article...definitely bookmarking.
I am so amazed at how upset people get when you mess with their cultural holidays and traditions and have no care or concern of the legitimacy of them. It seems only important to do what has been considered always done.
As I have been discovering the pagan backgrounds and roots of these holidays I have lost interest and enthusiasm for them. I now sincerely enjoy learning about Christ in the Biblical feasts and holidays presented in the Word.
I love these facts because it is so easy to be deceived by cultural practice and what ends up happening is that our faith ends up becoming like Santa Claus as if it were some made up story rather than the truth as presented in God's Word.
I feel we really need to participate and practice something based on fact and reality in order to be genuine and sincere and it is so important to know what we believe and why we believe it.
I found it interesting once while leading a discussion group with some teens around Easter (although I understand the roots on this as well I was trying to reach them on a level they might be familiar with) I asked them what they thought Easter was. They mentioned the easter bunny, eggs, candy, and food with relatives. Not one said a word about Jesus. I then asked does anyone have any idea about Jesus and Easter and no one had a clue. I concluded that stuffing Jesus into pagan religion doesn't always come out with an understanding of Jesus.
Thanks for a wonderfully informative article.
Blessings unto you Judah's Daughter! Wonderful article and well done...We celebrate the feasts of the Lord and have as of this past year celebrated the birth of Jesus during the Feast of Trumpets rather than Tabernacles (as many others believe it to be) because of reference to the blowing of the trumpets in heaven and announcement to the shepherds when He was born-so to us the evidence seemed more to lead towards Trumpets rather than Tabernacles. It also seemed like this would make more sense since He probably would've been circumcised on the Day of Atonement - symbolism of the removing of sin.
I'm glad you had all of this information to share with us, and I too look forward to the day when more of us will be even celebrating all of Yah's wonderful events and miracles during his appointed times and not our own...
Thanks again!
Ah, sister Tamarajo! I can soooo relate to what you've shared here. When I first read brother 'thefount's hub last year (the link is at the base of this hub), I admit I was saddened. When Halloween came around and the 'world' around me was celebrating, even Christians, I felt grieved. How we are programmed from the time of birth to expect, look forward to and practice all these things we 'love' ~ the dressing up, the candy, the tree, the presents...Are we saddened to give up these things or saddened the world is so caught up in them?
Initially, it was the former sadness for me ~ then the latter. God's truth has a way of penetrating our very soul/spirit, joints and marrow, thoughts and intent of our hearts (Heb 4:12). When we love Him, He gives us new 'eyes' to 'see' as He does. We begin to 'see' our sin and are saddened by it. We desire to remove ourselves from anything that is displeasing to Him, for He is so glorious and good.
I can see He is faithful to draw us into His truth, and because we are His sheep, we hear His voice and we follow Him alone. No other shepherd will we recognize!
God bless you abundantly, sister!!
FriendofTrugh, it is awesome that you have a celebration at the RIGHT time of year to celebrate the birth of our King! Hallelujah!
Yes, I look forward to all of us, in one accord, with and in Yeshua as our King and LORD, celebrating the wedding feast most of all!! Praise God ~ bless you!!
Very good, its nicely put together.
So your article and mine are non related "Evidence" that Jesus was born between September and October and both agree that Jesus was not born in December
Peace
Thanks, HOO ~ although your article places the birth of Jesus at October 6, 4 BC ~ one thing's for sure, we know there is plenty of evidence in the Bible that "Christmas" celebrated on December 25th is not biblical. Peace to you, also. ~~ JD
Actually, for the Jews, sunset was the beginning of the next day. So for Tishri 1 / Rosh Hashanah / Judean New Year to start at sunset on September 11th of 3 BC at 6:15 pm, then that is September 12. So Jesus was born on September 12th of 3 BC.
likewise, Jesus was crucified on Wednesday and died Wednesday at sunset, which is the beginning of Thursday, a ceremonial Sabbath, and 3 nights + 3 days later, Jesus rose from the grave on Saturday at sunset, which is the beginning of the first day of the week. Jesus did not rise from the grave at sunrise on Sunday as when pagans believed one of their pagan gods was resurrected. Shamefully, the death, burial, and resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ was paganized by man's church systems.
Thanks for writing this eye-opening article - for those with eyes-to-see.
Websense, our Jewish brothers have stated September 11th, so it must have been on the evening of September 10th as we know it, don't you think? What was used to figure this date (besides all the other evidence) was the NASA Lunar (moon) Phase Tables. Yes, the 'days' of creation and those of the Hebrew calendar are from sunset prior to sunsrise to sunset after sunrise. Does the DATE (ie Tishri 1) start at sunset or at sunrise?
According to the Bible, Mat 28:1-2 states, “Now after the Sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary came to look at the grave. And behold, a severe earthquake HAD occurred, for an angel of the Lord descended from heaven and came and rolled away the stone and sat upon it.” And, Mark 16:9 states, “Now after He HAD risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.”
What is considered 'early' on the first day of the week? The evening before? Midnight perhaps?
Thank you for your contribution and giving us more insight. God bless you.
Great job once again on your research! Not many people know the above facts, which I concur as valid evidence and testimony from my own studies as well. The 7 Hebrew feasts have a huge amount of prophetic wisdom on the coming, going, and return of Christ. A lot of the Messianic Jews I've met have made that connection but the info is slower getting out into the Christian ranks.
I've just looked at it this way more recently... that the various dates for "Christ-mass" celebrated by the Christian churches (either Dec 25th Roman OR Jan 15th Eastern Orthodox) simply reflect a time equating to the conception of Jesus Christ, with His actual birth date being 9 months later of course (Sept/Tishri) at the Feast of Trumpets.
And hooray! for the Feast of Tabernacles, the most prophetic of them all, for the Kingdom is at hand! -AMEN
Rev.Ted
Yes, brother Ted ~ some believe He will return on Rosh Hashanah ~ I wonder? Considering the Roman Catholic church has recognized and commemmorated the 'immaculate conception' on December 8th for centuries, even THEY KNOW Christ would have been born in September!!
The last referenced link states something about the conception date of Yeshua, as follows: "...If we count up the days from January 1 to September 11 in 3 BC (a non leap year, because 4 AD is a leap year which would make 1 BC a leap year), then we get 254 days. That means 18 days backwards in December of 4 BC, should be the exact date of the conception (December has 31 days). Our target should then be December 13, 4 BC for the date of the conception based on a 271 day average human gestation period for male babies. I should mention that the Hebrew word for pregnancy is "herayon" (hey resh yud vav nun). Since Hebrew letters also have numerical values it would be as follows:
hey=5, resh=200, yud=10, vav=6, nun=50; or total=5+200+10+6+50=271"
Fascinating!! Yes, Hooray! "The Word became flesh and dwelt [or 'tabernacled'] among us" (John 1:14). Rev 21:3-4 (NAS) "And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, 'Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and He will dwell among them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself will be among them, and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be any death; there will no longer be any mourning, or crying, or pain; the first things have passed away.'” Hallelujah!!
Fantastic... Hallelujah indeed!
I love the "spirit-filled" inspiration in which you dive into researching these facts so that everyone can see "the Word" and prophecy being fulfilled.
Kudos again... with blessings, Rev.Ted (and happy holidays)
Thank you soooo much, brother Ted. The LORD leads us with a fervor to get the WORD OUT to get the WORD IN!! Praise Him forevermore!!!
Beautiful, wonderful job on this Hub. I too thank the Lord Most High for the revelation that Christ was not born on December 25th. My family has not celebrated christmas for a few years now, since coming into this knowledge. I have also on several occasions tried to share this knowledge with others that profess to be Christians, however I have found many of them unwilling to let go of this pagan and worldly tradition. It pains me how many of us that profess to love God our Father, and Christ Jesus are so unwilling to receive the truth of the Word. Nevertheless, again I say thank you for this posting it is good to know that there are others that desire the sincere meat of the Word and not only the milk. Be Blessed!!!
You know, ChananPro, I was reading someone's comment on another hub the other day, someone who loves to celebrate the birth of Christ (termed as 'Christmas'), who stated something to the effect of 'I know there are those who consider Christmas to be of pagan origin...'; I thought to myself that it's not the celebration of Christ's birth that's of pagan origin; it's the date celebrated ~ and certainly some of the traditions (i.e. the Christmas tree, Santa Claus, yule logs, etc). Let's celebrate the Nativity, the birth of our LORD in September! No trees, no Santa, etc. Just the true worship of our Lord and His/our love for each other!!
God bless you ~ so glad to hear from you!
The way you have delivered this hub is very awesome! Be hard to dispute. Thanks!
Sister JD,
The important thing is that Christians know that Jesus was not born on the pagan day, December 25. That way we can discard all those pagan rituals and "stuff" associated with December 25.
I wrote my first comment since I thought it odd that someone calculates the time of Jesus' birth at the sunset of a day - the exact time that September 11 ends, instead of the beginning of a day. In my comment I left out a couple words and should have said, "sunset on September 11th of 3 BC at 6:15 pm, then that is "the beginning of" September 12". Seems like there are two possibilities:
1. God is exact, and Jesus was born at sunset on Sept. 11, which is also the beginning of Sept. 12. or
2. Jesus was born on a day - a 24-hour day - which begins when the previous day ends. That is Sept. 12, which begins on Sept. 11 at sunset. If the experts meant the beginning of the 24-hour day of Sept. 11, they would have said, Sept. 10 at sunset. It's not logical to refer to the beginning of a day as the exact moment when "that" day ends - sunset.
Thanks again for the article.
Pennyofheaven ~ thank you! It's wonderful to see a new face here in the hub comments! I appreciate you coming to read and commenting :-) God bless you!
Thank you, Websense. I have begun a little more research on your point of the 'day' of Jesus' birth ~ let's first start out with Luke 2:8-10:
"In the same region there were some shepherds staying out in the fields and keeping watch over their flock by NIGHT. And an angel of the Lord suddenly stood before them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them; and they were terribly frightened. But the angel said to them, 'Do not be afraid; for behold, I bring you good news of great joy which will be for all the people; for TODAY in the city of David there has been born for you a Savior, who is Christ the Lord."
So, we can see that the 'NIGHT' was indeed 'DAY' according to Hebrew/Jewish time. Thus far, I found the following statement on the internet interesting:
"...the Hebrew month began at the first appearance of the crescent Moon after the New Moon, which is assumed to be on September 10, the day after the actual New Moon. Tishri is the seventh month of the Hebrew calendar and the beginning of the New Year. Thus, the birth date of Jesus Christ according to the Great Sign in the heavens was September 11, 3 BC..."
While I'm enjoying the study, just knowing the month of the birth of our LORD is awesome!!
Sister JD,
In my first comment I mentioned about the 3 days and 3 nights that Jesus was in the grave to point to the importance of sunset in those calculations. The book, Babylon Mystery Religion, gives a very good description of how Jesus was buried on Wednesday at sunset and rose from the grave on Saturday at sunset. The author Ralph Woodrow sums things up this way:
"The gospel writers tell of several different visits made by the disciples to the tomb on that first day of the week. In every instance, they found the tomb empty. ... The first day of the week was when the disciples "discovered" that he was risen, but nowhere does the Bible actually say this was the time of the resurrection." That is how spiritual truths work. We cannot see spiritual truths with our own minds - they are in darkness to us. But when the Holy Spirit gives revelation, then it becomes light to us, and we see the truths with spiritual eyes. That is when spiritual truths become real to us subjectively, in our experience. But these spiritual truths existed before we could see them. Likewise, Jesus rose at sunset - it was dark. Later, when it was starting to get light at sunrise, the disciples saw that Jesus had already risen.
Also, for Mark 16:9, since there were no punctuation marks in the Greek manuscripts, the verse could read as, "Now when Jesus was risen, early the first day of the week he appeared first to Mary Magdalene." Ralph Woodrow states, "This seems to be the meaning originally intended, for the verses that follow show that Mark was recording the various appearances that Jesus made, not explaining on which day the resurrection took place."
Also consider Jesus' own words, "As Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Matt. 12:38-40
I hope that clarifies the 3 days and 3 nights.
I see the myth of "Roman Catholics are Pagans" raising it,s hideous head again.But I must draw your attention to the fact that the saints are not dead as you boldly stated!For as of this very moment they are in Heaven and therefore more alive than you or I,as those in Heaven are no longer subject to death. The saints in Heaven pray for us Revelation 5:8 (KJV) And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.Also please read Philemon (KJV) 1:5 Hearing of thy love and faith, which thou hast toward the Lord Jesus, and toward all saints. These are only two of many references in both the Old and New testaments of praying to saints for intercession.The saints in Heaven whom you say are dead bring the prayers of the living saints on earth to Christ who then brings them to the Father.The saints intercede to Christ in Heaven as we intercede to Christ on earth.
Your Brother in Christ Richard
Yes, Websense, Jesus rose the first day of the week, but that 'day' began at sunset on Saturday. I agree with your assessment ~ whether Jesus rose during the night or wee hours of the morning is still the first Hebrew/Jewish day of the week. Amen!! God bless you!!
RICKY RASPER, How many saints would you say the Catholic church recognizes? 24? Do you claim these saints are the 24 elders that bring before the throne the prayers of the earthly saints or the saints who've died? We don't know who the 24 elders are, but THEY bring the prayers of the saints on earth before the throne of God. We do not see the elders praying on our behalf. While I agree that those who die in Christ are with Him the moment they take their last breath, they are not interceding for us and we are not to pray to them or through them. The Bible is clear on this:
Isaiah 8:19 "When they say to you, 'Consult the mediums and the spiritists who whisper and mutter,' should not a people consult their God? Should they consult the dead on behalf of the living?" And, look at what happened to Saul when he wanted to consult Samuel after Samuel died! (1 Sam 28) Saul was killed shortly thereafter. Consider also, when John fell at the feet of the angel in Rev 19:10! The angel said to John, "Do not do that; I am a fellow servant of yours and your brethren who hold the testimony of Jesus; worship God."
Philemon 1:5 is speaking of living, breathing saints (on earth). We are not to disturb the souls of the saints who have passed on before us. There is only ONE Mediator between God and man, Jesus Christ - as Son of God/Son of Man, in that He died for our sins (1 Tim 2:5). And while you may believe God is three, the Spirit of Christ is the Holy Spirit, which is God (John 4:24; Rom 8:9; Acts 5:3-4). If the Holy Spirit were another 'person' of the Godhead (which merely means Diety), the Holy Spirit would be the Father of Christ, not Father God. Can you see that the Holy Spirit IS the Father God? He makes intercession for us (Rom 8:26 and Heb 7:25). If you would like more proof that God is ONE LORD, I have several hubs on the subject. I suggest you read "ROCK OF OFFENSE" to see how the Catholic church contributed to the latter-day three-part God doctrine. That hub will give you clear, scriptural proof that Jesus is YHWH.
I love you in the love of the Lord, and do not mean to sound harsh; I just pray your understanding will be opened by the Lord Jesus Christ, as He did for His disciples in Luke 24:45.
Dear JD To whom was Jesus praying in the garden of Gethsemane?
To whom was Christ speaking when on the cross he said " Father,why have thou forsaken me?."?
PS I am not Roman Catholic I am a Presbyterian!
Your Brother in Christ Richard
As far as I am aware the Catholic church reconises all christians as saints even those of the Prodestant faih.
Regards Richard.
Hi RICKY RASPER, the "Protestants" broke away from the Catholic church and for good reason. Unfortunately, however, they took the teachings of Lucifer being Satan himself and the 'trinity' with them. I have a hub called "Is Lucifer the Devil?" you may want to read to challenge this doctrine: http://hubpages.com/_ui1xcnn62gpk/hub/Is-Lucifer-t
Jesus was God in the flesh. God is Spirit, the Holy Spirit, and is omnipresent. In the flesh, He was the Son of God, and Son of Man. He was made a little lower than God (Psalm 8:5) and when you compare this to Heb 2:9, He was made a little lower than the angels. Elohim includes the Spirit of God, His image in His Christ, the angels, magistrates and even us! Consider what Jesus said in John 10:34-36 "Jesus answered them, 'Has it not been written in your Law, 'I SAID, YOU ARE GODS'? If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'?" The word 'God' here is the Greek rendition of the Hebrew 'elohim', which is originally written in Ps 82:6: "I said, 'You are gods [elohim], And all of you are sons of the Most High.'"
God revealed Himself to us in Spirit (clouds by day and fire by night, as an example found in the Old Testament - i.e. Neh 9:12), and revealed Himself in the flesh, Jesus Christ. He is now Spirit that indwells each of us, and whomever is born again of Him (of the Spirit) is a saint. It is true that all the saints are alive, though their flesh has died. Same with God, except that He had no beginning, and His Spirit existed everywhere outside of the Son and was in the Son. Now we can understand so much about the comments of the Son of Man (i.e. 'My Father is greater than I', etc.)
I pray this enlightens you even more, as you are a shepherd of the sheep. God is Truth, and His Truth will penetrate all forms of error. That is His promise. God bless you.
While I applaud your research in coming up with an exact date for the birth of Christ, I'm confused about your motivation. Ihope you are not saying that God is displeased with His children for celebrating the birth of His Son on December 25th. There is so much good that happens around this time of year because of Christmas. The world stops each year to reflect on the significance of the birth of Christ. People love more, give more, pray more, help others more, this time of year than any other. As the days become shorter due to the winter solstice, depression mounts. It is the magic of Christmas that brings much needed hope to so many. No other day draws so many together for the purpose of doing good. While much has changed over recent years, the attacks of the politically correct, the attacks of the secular world, and commercialism, we as the church need to come together and stand united to proclaim unashamed and boldly without apology, the true meaning of Christmas. Do you think it possible to change the world to celebrate the birth of Christ to September 11 or 12? Neither do I. We know the significance of WHAT we celebrate. I believe God is pleased in spite of the date.
My 2 cents.
Hi fredallen,
I was just thinking this morning about the Catholic church’s motivation for setting Christ-Mass on the day of Saturnalia’s birth of the Sun god, in order to convert those who practiced such things to Christianity. First, 1 Cor 9:22 came to mind, “To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak; I have become all things to all men, so that I may by all means save some.” Does this mean we partake of their practices, or call their practices by God’s name?
In an article I will link below (for sake of copyrights) I found this: “During their winter festival or Saturnalia, the Roman's decorated trees with small pieces of metal in honor of Saturnus, the god of agriculture. Decorated trees and games were enjoyed throughout the festival. Centuries ago in Great Britain, Druids, or wood priest as they were called, used evergreens during winter solstice rituals. During these rituals, The Druids played games and used holly and mistletoe as symbols of eternal life. They also placed evergreen branches over doors to keep away evil spirits.” http://www.articlebasement.com/articles/45209/1/Ch
Now, I suppose we can understand Jeremiah 10:2-4 (KJV) “Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. For the customs of the people [are] vain: for [one] cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.”
The tree, holly, mistletoe, yule logs, and most of the customs practiced during Christmas are those of the festival of Saturnalia. Saint Nicholas is the world’s ‘god’ that is given the attributes of the true God. We are not to ‘share’ God’s glory with another. That is idoloatry. We’ve come to love the customs so much that we ‘justify’ our behaviors because we love God? How do we show God we love Him? Is this a holy way? Celebrate in September, without the lore of the heathen.
Celebrating the birth of Christ is a beautiful thing, however, it’s the ROOT of our customs that appear to be unholy, and I can’t say God is pleased. You’re speaking of the beautiful ‘tree’, while not paying attention to its roots. It’s just like the Adversary to call what is unclean, clean. Leviticus 10:10 states, “And that ye may put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean” and Isaiah 5:20 states, “Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!”
John 15:19 states, “If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you.” Compare this with Rev 18:4 “I heard another voice from heaven, saying, ‘Come out of her, my people, so that you will not participate in her sins and receive of her plagues.’”
Therefore, it’s up to your heart what you will do with the customs of celebrating Christmas (when and how). The LORD is the judge of our hearts. I am not to tell you what to do; the Holy Spirit does this for each one of us.
There is much we agree on. This is to me a sacred acknowledgement of the greatest event in the history of the world. The day God put on flesh and walked among us. If He never convicted me of the "evil" of celebrating the birth of Christ on December 25 would you think that I'm not listening hard enough? Is it not possible that God has put His blessing on this special day? Does He not have that perogotive? I believe that what I put in my first comment is true. The tree is beautiful, cannot God make the root holy and acceptable? I hope it is not your contention that all who celebrate Christmas are despised by God. Over eating is a sin. Calling someone fool puts people in danger of Hell. We all commit sin. Jesus came to set us free. I guess I have no hope if He doesn't forgive me for celebrating His birth on Christmas. I guess "woe unto me" for believing in the magic of the Christmas season. I guess I'm calling bitter, sweet and darkness, light for spreading the hope of the Christmas season. I have come out from among them. My life is His. But the heathen and their lore have need of this remembrence of God with us.
I understand where so many of us are about this, brother fredallen. We were born into tradition; we were taught what we've been taught. It's only been in these latter years Christians are finding out this information, and what will we do with it? I wish it had started out right, for we wouldn't have this question. If God continues to lead us out from this, we will know it and we will have peace and joy about it. I just felt it necessary to bring this to light, not with the motivation to take the joy out of Christmas (the true meaning), but to give us the truth of the matter and let God do the rest. Blessings always, JD
I am so thankful for good writing that is based upon truth. It blesses my heart and makes me feel joy. God Bless you.
Praise God, yet again, fellow servant, Jachda! I, too am thankful that He is faithful to lead us into truth. The grieving we feel when this happens is over our past ignorance and blindness. The good news is, we can repent and follow Him ~ choose to follow Him, which brings JOY!! Unfortunately, it will also bring ridicule from those who have not yet been enlightened, and love darkness rather than light. If they truly love the Lord, they will remain under conviction, for God desires all men repent and walk in the true knowledge of Him who loves them. God bless you abundantly!!
I must say that I love the discussion. All that I care about is that HE WAS BORN. AMEN
God Bless.
Yes, amen bettybarnesb! I watched a story of Mary and Joseph yesterday ~ how Mary was ridiculed for believing God was bearing His Son through her, though she was a virgin and betrothed. She had courage, was alone and submitted to the will of God, even to His death on the cross. May we have that same Spirit within us, to love God and follow His will, no matter what the cost. God bless you.
Enjoyed this piece, JD. For those who think it's okay to make up a Christian name for a pagan celebration, they might want to read the Biblical reasons the Jews went into Babylonian captivity. One was for not letting the land rest on its seventh-year Sabbaths, the other was for mixing pagan worship with their worship of Yahweh. It's one thing to "like" something ourselves; it's another to claim God likes things he's forbidden.
JudyJudy, thanks so much for sharing. I think of how the Israelites, under Aaaron, no less, made the golden calf to honor the God that brought them out of Egypt. Ex 32:4 "He [Aaron] took this [gold] from their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool and made it into a molten calf; and they said, 'This is your god, O Israel, who brought you up from the land of Egypt.'" We are not to use anything pagan to worship or attribute to YHVH.
It's not uncommon for those who love Christmas and deeply believe it is to celebrate Christ's birth (in spite of all the biblical and historical evidence to the contrary) to say those speaking up about the origins of Christmas are attempting to take 'Christ' out of 'Christmas'. I don't believe He was ever in Christmas to begin with, and frankly we're making an effort to take Christmas out of Christ. Man has made God fit his desires, and we need to change that to man fitting God's desires; amen!
We Muslims are also told that Jesus (peace be upon him) was born in the ninth month of the lunar calendar and so it was incredibly refreshing to have come across this article.
Traveller99, Truth unites, doctrines divide; amen. Long before the Catholic church or Islam became 'doctrines', the Truth was born, the Savior of all mankind, Whom the Bible reveals, based on my studies, is God with us (Immamuel). Isa 7:14 prophesies, "Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, a virgin will be with child and bear a son, and she will call His name Immanuel."
Isa 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD, And there is no savior besides Me."
Isa 45:21 "And there is no other God besides Me, A righteous God and a Savior; There is none except Me."
Hosea 13:4 "Yet I have been the LORD your God Since the land of Egypt; And you were not to know any god except Me, For there is no savior besides Me."
Isa 45:21 calls Him the righteous God and Savior. If we look at the New Testament in Titus 2:13 "looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus" and 2 Pet 1:1 "To those who have obtained a faith of equal standing with ours by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ", we know He is as stated in Isa 9:6 "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace."
Truth is refreshing (a rock of offense to some), and I praise God His Spirit leads us into all Truth, just as Jesus said in John 16:13 "But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come." We know this is the Spirit of Christ, because He said in John 14:18, "I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you." This happened on the Day of Pentecost in Acts 2.
Furthurmore, Rom 8:9 confirms, "However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him." May Jesus Christ be praised, for He is YHWH, God our Savior.
Thank you for confirming this truth, that Jesus was indeed born in September. Blessings to you.
Great hub, and thank you for sharing. Merry Christmas!
Our belief on Jesus' (peace be upon him) differs, as we regard him as a prophet, although a very important one, and this coincides with several verses from the Bible, namely:
* Matthew 21:11
* Luke 7:10-20
* Luke 24:15-19.
Peace be with you.
Just wanted to stop and agree with everyone posting above!
EXCELANT hub, very informative.
Thank You for all your hard work.
Peace be with you, also Traveller99.
oceansunsets, Thank you and I hope you are yet enjoying the love of family and friends in the love of the Lord.
Hi Jerami ~ Good to see you! Thank you so much and God bless you!
We really love reading your article. Keep it up!
Thank you, FirstCommunion ~ may the Lord continue to give me more understanding and inspiration to write as He leads, to feed His sheep. God bless you!!
Great hub my friend, love reading your work. Have a great and safe New Year :) God Bless You my Christian sister...
Thank you, wolfpack5!! You're such a blessing! Happy and Blessed New Year 2011 to you also!! May Jesus Christ be PRAISED this Day!!
I had heard about the birth of Christ being on September 11th, but never in this much detail. Kudos.
Hey there stranger! Good to see you! Thank you kindly. I hope you know I continue to feel the strong love of Jesus in my heart for you.
Hello to you as well. I've been on hiatus, but I may slowly start to come back.
Thanks. :)
Unfortunately it has been proven that Herod's death had to be in 4 B.C. so your date of Jesus' birth is wrong.
ggg, would you please provide that proof, and also answer all the other signs and support of the date of Jesus' birth mentioned in this hub? It's fine to challenge, but why not reason the 'proof'? That would be much more respectable, don't you think?
For me, my motive is to understand the significance of the Jewish New Year holiday and the other feasts during this season. Can anyone help with that? I believe He was born on Rosh Hashana since that is the date of creation and Yeshua is our Creator! So how fitting for Him to be born that day! Yet what then is yom kippur and booths? Anyone?
Hi Abraham! If you google Jewish feasts you will find a ton of information there. I think it's awesome that not only was Jesus born on Rosh Hashana, but it also involves two witnesses being sent up on the mount to watch for the first sliver of the new moon, which can happen within a 48-hour period. This is known as "The day or hour no one knows" - Ah! Jesus gave this idiom to His disciples when they asked the timing of His return (Mat 24:36)! Indeed, He will come again at Rosh Hashana!
Thus far, Rosh Hashana was the birth of our LORD; Booths is the Feast of Tabernacles (the Word became flesh and 'tabernacled' among us); Passover/Feast of Unleavened Bread was His crucifixion; Feast of First Fruits was His resurrection and Pentecost was the outpouring of His Spirit upon believers. We have yet to see Rosh Hashana, once again (return of our LORD); feast of Atonement (Yom Kippur) and the Wedding Feast! And He will forever 'tabernacle' among us. Be blessed!!
Have you seen the movie "The Star of Bethlehem"? It talks about this. According to this documentary you are correct but the wise men visited Jesus ON...DECEMBER 25th! So you can still put the nativity up with the Wise men on the 25th! It's a fascinating movie. Oh and you can watch it on You Tube but it's difficult to hear.
Hi Brie! I have referenced "The Star of Bethlehem" in this publication, but have not seen the movie. I'll be sure to view it. I always appreciate hearing from you!
I'm sure you won't take this personally, but I've got to share my two cents. How anyone can determine the date the wise men arrived to see the toddler, Jesus, is beyond me. Even if this were true, I don't see any justification in celebrating the BIRTH of Christ on December 25th. The wise men weren't there in September, so I don't think they'll be at my nativity scene with baby Jesus.
Deut 12:30-31 comes to mind - KJV "Take heed to thyself that thou be not snared by following them, after that they be destroyed from before thee; and that thou inquire not after their gods, saying, How did these nations serve their gods? even so will I do likewise. Thou shalt not do so unto the LORD thy God: for every abomination to the LORD, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods." Well, we don't sacrifice our sons and daughters, but nonetheless, we celebrate the birth of Christ on the day pagans celebrate the birth of their gods, let alone the practice of bringing trees into the home and propogating Santa Claus (aka Saint Nicholas) to our children (as our parents ignorantly did with us).
I think of the golden calf in the desert that Israel created and decided to worship as the image of the 'God [430-Elohim] who brought them out of Egypt' (Ex 32:4). God wasn't too happy...
I love you, sister. Thanks so much for reading and commenting. God bless you!!
When you watch the movie you will see how they know. I don't want to spoil it for you, it's pretty cool. Regarding celebrating holidays on certain days. The scripture that comes to mind for me is "to the pure all things are pure'. I don't like all the secularization of Christmas to be sure but I do enjoy celebrating with my family and personally I don't think God cares what day as long as we are his.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
I think as long as you are celebrating Christ whether his birth or death or Resurrection God is pleased.
Yes, I will enjoy the time with my family as well. As Christians, we are to walk in the truth, so knowing what is revealed it's up to each of us to do what is pleasing to God alone, not others. It was man who made December 25th a holy day, originally to other gods, so I personally don't feel celebrating Christ's birth on December 25th is the holy thing to do. It's not for me to 'judge' anyone in respect to what they choose to do, as God has given every man free choice. The 'shadow' spoken of in respect to holy days (feasts), new moons and Sabbath days were specifically those of Israel. Israel never celebrated the birth of Christ or any holy day on December 25th. Yes, let's celebrate Christ every day of the year, for this is pleasing to Him. Thanks again, Brie! Can't wait to see the movie!
Let me know after you watch it..what you think.
amazing just so good.
It IS amazing, sister jesusmyjoy! Amen!
Still a classic Hub I keep linking back too! :)
Praise God, christ4ever ~ so blessed by you!!
P.S. The movie "The Star of Bethlehem" that BRIE mentioned is really good - there is supposed to be Planetarium shows ciculating (based on Mosley and Martin's work) with the same in the U.S. as well (have not seen yet)... Rev.Ted
Hi sister Brie! I JUST watched "The Star of Bethlehem" (now available through Netflix). What a precious documentary! Here are my thoughts:
1) Life definitely begins at conception, yes. The movie asks the question, was Sept 11, 3 BC the 'conception' of Jesus? I believe that because it is written that at the time the Woman was clothed with the sun, had the crown of 12 stars and the moon under her feet (9/11/3BC), "she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered. And she brought forth a man child." This was the delivery.
2) The Star standing still exactly on 12/25 (as he then called 'The First Christ-Mass') should not mean we celebrate the birth of Christ on that day. Rather, I could accept that we give gifts to each other on that day because that is what the Magi did ~ they brought gifts to the King of kings.
3) The blood moon on the day of Christ's crucifixion was awesome. Joel's prophecy was fulfilled ~ as preached by the Apostle Peter on the Day of Pentecost. Reading the words of Jesus in Mat 24:29, we know He was not prophesying of His imminent death, or even the Day of Pentecost to come, but is yet to be fulfilled: vs. 29-30 (KJV) "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power and great glory."
We look for the blessed hope, the resurrection of the saints at Christ's return, which according to Paul's letter to Timothy, had not yet happened in his day: 1 Tim 2:18 "They have left the path of truth, claiming that the resurrection of the dead has already occurred; in this way, they have turned some people away from the faith." (These are the Preterists!!)
We will stand steadfast in the faith, "looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus!" (Titus 2:13). Hallelujah!!!
Everyone needs to watch this movie, for sure!
Let's just hope the Bible gets other things wrong also.
Hi peanutroaster, Did you mean "Let's just hope the Bible proves traditional teachings wrong on other things also"? The Bible is not wrong about this; it's the teachings of the RCC that are wrong. Blessings.
Fascinating! I look forward to reading your other "hubs" too. I do have one question: You stated "The Bible gives clues that John was born around the time of Passover (Nisan, in the Spring)". Than in a followup post said Nisan is commonly accepted. What are the clues in the Bible that John was born around Pasover?
Thank you, chinavoyager2002!
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gary.h.turner/XmasSep
While the link provided above has the wrong years for the calculations, it does provide some great information about the birth of John the Baptist, which I have written below.
John's father, Zechariah (Z'chariyahu in Hebrew), was of the priestly division of Abiah (or Abijah) (Lk. 1:5). There were 24 such divisions (1 Chr. 24:7-18) taking their turn over the course of the year. Abiah was the 8th division (1 Chr. 24:10).
According to the Mishnah (the Jewish commentary on the Torah), the priestly cycle began on the first Sabbath (Saturday) of Nisan, and each division ministered for one week. The cycle got delayed because all priests were required to attend the Holy Temple (Beit Hamikdash in Hebrew) at Passover, Pentecost and Tabernacles. The 8th division would have served in Sivan (June). After Zechariah returned home...well, add on a bit of time for conception, then add nine months and John would have been born at Passover.
Jesus said John was ‘Elijah who was to come’ (Mat 11:14) and the Jews expected that Elijah would come at Passover – it is their custom to put an extra cup of wine on the table at Passover in the hope that Elijah will come and drink it.
Likewise, the writer of the article link above also places Jesus' birth in September. Fascinating, indeed!
"Historian Ernest L. Martin consulted NASA lunar-phase tables and found the image of the heavens in Revelation 12, the time of Jesus’ birth. “‘The moon under her feet’ could only occur during an eighty minute period on September 11th of 3 BC between sunset at ‘6:15pm and moonset at 7:45pm’ (The Birth of Christ Recalculated and The Star that Astonished the World, page 85, 1996.)"
Isn't it awesome that God confirms His word to those who are willing to except the evidence! It says in the scriptures:
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse..." (Rom1:18-20)
Yes, wba108@yahoo.com ~ Amen. Makes us 'think' of how we now feel when Christ's birth continues to be celebrated on Dec 25th - oh, the roots of that particular 'day' when it comes to false gods! Is it not an abomination of the 'church'?! Same thing with 'Easter' (the eggs, rabbits, 'lent')!! In fact, God calls those who mourned for 40 days for Tammuz (now called 'Lent' 40 days before that celebration of 'Easter') an ABOMINATION (Ezek 8:13-14). We ARE without excuse.
God's Truth is being revealed to those who are merely ignorant, so they know better. Those who truly love God will repent; those who are in love with their traditions and deny the severity of what they're doing, love their traditions.
Mark 7:8 "Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men."
Your comment was inspirational and anointed. Thank you and God bless you abundantly.
DiamondRN 17 months ago
Excellent article, JD.
I have always thought (no proof)that Jesus was born in the Spring for various reasons.
Thanks for your well-thought-out insight and research.
Voted up and useful.